Its impossible to say, but I think the odds are pretty good that some of these sightings are legit. Rick van de Poll: Rick your thoughts. You could trace that was this same cat from point to point to point. JavaScript must be enabled for some features to display properly. It's bigger but bigger and better world. So what a neat experience. We live around Cold Springs Campground and it was undeniably a mountain lion. Sue Morse: The big cat really commands the utmost respect not so much fear but fascination. Join as a $8 per month sustainer and get our brand-new owl umbrella! Patrick Tate: So one thing I'd say is DNA would definitely identify an animal animal's Mark line or not. Caller: Hey guys how you doing. We mentioned that one cat that was hit by a car where it has it that it was a male looking for me. How to Report a Possible Mountain Lion Sighting. From "History of New Hampshire Game and Furbearers" by Helenette Silver, Research Clerk, NH Fish and Game Dept. 1,470 likes. Sam Evans-Brown: Well first I want to sort of explain why what the theory is but then also throw a bit of cold water on it because I don't think there's much much logic behind it but essentially is that if fish and game were to acknowledge that there was a population of Mount lions in the state there's a chance that something like a listing under the federal Endangered Species Act might happen and then there'd be you know some they'd have to put a plan in place to protect the species there'd be you know restrictions put on development. We'll hear more about the mountain lions impact and the role it plays in the ecosystem. Some of the reports that I looked into that were actually on file at the local fish and game office were even from people who did not live locally. From: Boomerdog in OK 08-Oct-07 N.H.'s Fish and Game department says there's no proof mountain lions live in the state, yet residents from Bedford to Berlin have been reporting sightings for years. Good morning guys. Numerous scat and fur specimens have been turned in as part of mountain lion report investigations; DNA identification has shown these submitted samples to be from domestic dog, coyote, bobcat andraccoon. Me Im willing to believe its possible that there are some out there. Rick van de Poll: Rick van de Poll so I was a non-believer as well. N.H.'s Fish and Game department says there's no proof. Your support makes this news available to everyone. And you know all that. He said matter of fact I do. Peter Biello: What about the idea of tourism like us leaving aside the fact that it is not on the Endangered Species Act is it. Mountain Lions are a mythical creature in New Hampshire with strong feelings on both sides of the question: are there Mountain Lions in New Hampshire? John if you're still on the line here I was going to I don't. That's next time on one day. Patrick Tate: Exactly I was gonna bring that up juvenile male of. Sam Evans-Brown: What he would have stopped as well I think is way way that the reason that mountain lion kept moving is because he wasn't finding anybody. Reviewing the evidence, the U.S. I'll send it to you. Patrick Tate: I've from all the situations I've read and learned about wildlife. Let's look for other evidence. 44-N Links. Caller: It had to be a mountain lion convinced I was about 30. Don't miss your chance to win three two thousand dollar gas gift cards at any station of your choice not to mention the grand prize twenty five thousand dollars toward a new car. Peter Biello: And then it ran away okay. So I certainly can't dispute anything that they said there's no evidence for me to go by to verify or say what my thoughts are on the situation. Residents Report Mountain Lion Sighting By Elysia Rodriguez Published August 11, 2015 A southern New Hampshire neighborhood believes a mountain lion is roaming the woods near their homes. I really really enjoyed listening to this program so thank you all very much. Rick van de Poll: Well education is the real important thrust of of what all of us do as biologists and Game Managers and to make sure that a things like what Sam was saying that in spite of what you believe the mountain lions will not eat your children they will not steal your pets from your backyard and they will not necessarily be seen by you unless you're extremely lucky. I believe I saw one that's fine and I'm not looking for an immediate story. It was some sort of a Lion Mountain Lion animal. We'll push great photos to the front page. Fish and Wildlife Service decided all of the cougars, pumas, and mountain lions in the country are actually the same species, and that species hasnt had a breeding population anywhere near the Northeast for at least 70 years. The current estimate is 2,000 - 2,700 throughout Arizona. The supervisor that hired me in the game division in October of 1978 passed on to me this whole big folder of mountain lion information and sightings going back probably a couple decades. We have evidence and as biologists we would find it quite exciting to find that evidence of one in the state. Caller: Yeah I hadn't experienced blastoff fall so this was around September and I was driving from Webster into Concord on Horse Hill Road and anybody in the area would know I was right near the Red Barn and all of a sudden this animal jumps out of the woods and it bounded across the road in about two two giant leaps and stopped in the field just on the other side. We'll be right back. So maybe a good pet for you but not for your neighbor if you just stop by unannounced. Peter Biello: Ok weird question but do they make good pets. Rick your thoughts. From came from out west they tracked it all the way back to the Black Hills in the Dakotas. No evidence and other states where Mountain lights have turned up. As recently as 2011 there was one young male mountain lion that cruised all the way from the black hills of South Dakota, up over the Great Lakes, down through New Yorkgetting spotted all. Just. Any sense of of whether or not mountain lions are sort of wary of more population dense areas like like the one he was describing Rick. So one thing I'll add. And just one more note about this danger question when even when you look at the states that have extended populations stable populations of mountain lions attacks are relatively rare. The Connecticut Mountain Lion is the best documented wild Mountain Lion in New England. You know one of the the biggest questions I have about that is it points to how much we don't know and if in fact we don't know enough. Ecosystem Management Consultants of New England, Ask Sam, and recently fielded question about mountain lions, 10 things to do in NH this weekend: Dartmouth Dance, Hamilton De Holanda & more, Turkish restaurant in the Upper Valley aims to help those affected by recent earthquakes, RFK Jr. tells NH crowd hes considering a presidential run, Epping woman pleads guilty to threatening Michigan election official in 2020, We also hear excerpts from an interview with, Read about the most recent cougar "sightings". And we want to know your stories if you have them 1 800 8 9 2 6 4 7 7 or email exchange at an HP bar dot org we'll talk about conspiracy theories when we come back. and territorial animals are much more inclined to create a problem with passer bys than dispersing animals in fact I'd be totally shocked if a dispersal would encounter with a human purposefully unless they had already had some type of training to do so. Thank you. So nowadays we think of this in the Northeast as crazy stuff that people have a mountain lion as a pet. So so in 2011 a mountain lion was killed in a car accident in Connecticut a car hit a mountain lion and killed it. Caller: Oh yeah. PublishedNovember 16, 2018 at 6:16 AM EST. 44-H Links. There's just one subspecies of North American mountain lion. John is calling from Bennington. Support for an age PR comes from you our listeners. A 140-pound male mountain lion was hit by a car and killed in 2011 in Milford, Connecticut. Is this kind of a typical story. By, March 2023 Fund Drive Rules and Regulations, Persons with disabilities who need assistance accessing NHPR's FCC public files, please contact us at publicfile@nhpr.org. But if people are still seeing mountain lions, why is the state and federal government seeking to COVER IT UP!? Now again I don't know that there's anything to that. You can see two of them at Squam Lakes Natural Science Center in Holderness NH. 10 things to do in NH this weekend: Dartmouth Dance, Hamilton De Holanda & more, Turkish restaurant in the Upper Valley aims to help those affected by recent earthquakes, RFK Jr. tells NH crowd hes considering a presidential run, Epping woman pleads guilty to threatening Michigan election official in 2020. Mountain lions can be found throughout Arizona, and data suggests the populations are not only stable, but growing. Sam Evans-Brown: Well this might be a good moment to talk about hoaxes. He writes As a farmer I come across many outdoorsman looking to hunt our property had a conversation with one who believed very strongly that we had mountain lions in New Hampshire. But the state always denies it, and none of us know why they deny it. Lions Clubs Int'l Links: LionNet NH Links 2011 -2012 . Sunny today high temperatures low to mid 80s it'll be clear tonight overnight lows in the 50s for tomorrow sunshine with high temperatures mid to upper 80s. But you can continue the conversation on Facebook or at our Web site and HP Borg. So so do what you can get to do what you can to get proof. Caller: And the more I thought about it the color of it it was definitely not a bobcat. I'm Peter Biello in for Laura NOI. Pat ruse and he was sampling doing DNA samples from cats in the Upper Peninsula of Michigan. They just end up in these places. Mountain lions remain an enigmatic animal for residents of New Hampshire, with New Hampshire Fish and Game reporting three to five sightings per week. Less than a year later I found a scat on the swamp range and I was working at the time with a fellow at the Michigan wildlife habitat Federation. But you won't find evidence of their existence in paw prints in the snow or a deer carcass in a tree. Phone number 1 800. You've got you've got biologists right who are trying to make their make their way in the world make a career if you are the biologists who confirmed a sighting of mountain lions in the state that would be very good for you like you would be all over the news. 50 feet above the most. Chartered: 1973 . Sort of dropped onto the SD card of a camera he'd set up out in the wild. Peter Biello: Sam I wanted to ask you a little bit about that first and then turn to Patrick Tate efficient game. Patrick Tate: So it's interesting it's brought up. The 17-year-old Kiger mustang mare was born in Bend, Oregon, said Hodskins, who got her . In fact, Pat Tate concedes that hes been told of sightings from folks that he considers to be very credible, very woods savvypeople who know what a bobcat looks likebut those folks have never snapped a good photo or found a good track. Absolutely. For starters, part of the confusion might come from the fact that the eastern cougar was taken off the endangered species list earlier this year. So this whole illegal pet trade black market pro trade thing does does exist in a situation like that can happen. Information online ad an age student loans dawg. So if you were to ask me has a mountain lion ever passed through New Hampshire and been spotted by somebody who wasnt able to get hard evidence? Id personally be willing to say "probably, yes.". Caller: I have yeah. He played a pivotal role and he battled for recognition. Tell us your story. They reported seeing the big tail and everything everything. Because I mean as we've heard in the past 10 minutes like there's there's some disagreement or at least some some vagueness about what an actual mountain lion should appear like in the wild assuming we can even get close enough. HOLDERNESS, N.H. (AP) Two of the known mountain lions in New Hampshire have spent their 15 years in close proximity to humans. Have you seen one. I would just suggest that in my experience as a reporter covering this covering this issue for a few years at least at what point do we reach a certain critical mass for lack of a better term of accounts where I'm not to suggest that you guys aren't taking this possibility seriously. Peter Biello: So a little bit of nostalgia maybe for it for a better world embodied in the mountain lion. 1 800 8 9 2 6 4 7 7. Rick shaking his head so Rick now correct me please. It's not an emerging endangered species no work no there are there are populations in specific states so the Florida panther is is an endangered species that sub population is in fact listed under the Endangered Species Act. Mountain Lion | Squam Lakes Natural Science Center All exhibit and hiking trails are CLOSED for the season. So yeah as far as wildlife species that put deer and trees know there aren't any others that I know of that put deer in trees just just humans might be responsible for that. So here in New Hampshire when a person turns in something that the Department believes is possible mountain lion and believes it should be investigated further. Yeah I did. Well Is DNA the most reliable means we have of identifying whether or not what we saw is actually a mountain lion. Thanks for a great thanks. We are the second most-forested state in the country, and those forests can be impenetrable snarls (part of why the Northeast is notoriously a difficult place to hunt deer), and while there are people in a lot of those woods, because the cats have been absent for a few generations now, most of those people dont know what a cougar scrape or latrine look and smell like. They're just moving around freely. Mountain lions live in the state. Patrick Tate: So Cougar Mountain Lion katama. So hard to know hard to refute if there's no interest in making up a story which many people of course do then I would respond the same way as Pat did. I saw that had this giant the bobcat had this giant sweeping which is John Bobcat don't have big sweeping tails. The big cat has been extinct here since the mid-1800s. Peter Biello: Well hey Rob. So I don't understand really how how this this idea came to be but it is the main reason why folks believe that fishing game is is covering up the fact that there are mountain lions in the state again with no evidence. I think as Pat was saying you know 35 to 50 pounds on a male be reasonable range whereas mountain lions you're up to 100 110 maybe even 130 pounds on a big male. You're on the air. She quotes a biologist in Lyme New Hampshire who who is keeping two mountain lions himself so in the not too distant past in the early nineteen hundreds it was perhaps more common and still in Maine. It all used to be based on measurable physical traits color, skull size, paw size, etc but now its based on whether an animal can be shown to be genetically distinct from others. Right. Do you get a lot of these these these things that end up being hoaxes. There's these animals aren't coming with a map saying oh I want to go here. Patrick Tate: So I'm not sure what subspecies of cat they're using to differentiate by those markings but once she was describing the White other face in the black. I'm gonna send you a letter that we researched this report and we spoke with those labs and the lab wrote in their letter to us that they could only say that Scott contained white Tea Party fur and that they could not say what deposited the scout because it's far too degraded listeners we'd love to hear from you about your mountain lion sightings if you have seen one or if you if you think you have give us a call we'd love to hear your story 1 800 8 9 2 6 4 7 7. The exchange is a production of New Hampshire Public Radio. Patrick Tate: I would say well when social media first started they picked up the hoaxes became much more prevalent in the last four or five years hoaxes have died down completely. Patrick Tate: So the individuals can say that but for an agency that's based on science and what not to to go off with no evidence and then get into that giant debate and all these other issues and put credibility at risk I don't think that would be a great path to take. I'm Peter B yellow. Current conditions in New Hampshire would support a mountain lion, according to Tate, as forests have returned, allowing for prey species to become more prevalent. We rely on readers like you to support the local, national, and international coverage on this website. But my experience was that the majority of these accounts could not be taken lightly. John. And I have to use that word allegedly because there is so much dispute about what people see and what they actually see. Hunting is legal, but closely regulated by the state. And the cougar embodies that. Were there any differences between these two that we could have noticed right off. You don't know what's going on. Wed love to be part of the first verified sighting. Peter Biello: Well John thanks very much for the story really appreciate it. The brother and sister big cats have lived . We're gonna talk about sightings in this part of the program as well we'd love to hear your story. Erler is a senior naturalist at the Squam Lakes Natural Science Center in Holderness. 1957. And the second question is this a behavior mountain lions exhibit. Absolutely there are a lot of folks out there who for some reason need to create something that raises a stir and gets the attention of the media etc.. N.H. And it came out we could see it had and we could see its long swooping tail. Information that weed family automotive dot com sunny for today high temperatures low to mid 80s clear tonight overnight lows in the 50s tomorrow sunny highs in the upper 80s. Email exchange it an HP fraud org or give us a call 1 800 8 9 2 6 4 7 7. So I will just say this is a big reason why there have not been confirmed sightings I think is that the evidence required first. Enable JavaScript by changing your browser options, and then try again. So for me as a person who's had the Bobcats right off my grits similar carries sticks to a bobcat The Long Tail obviously very different but those facial markings were overlapping for me. Oh you saw him online. The females disperse a shorter range and once they find a vacant home range they stay in that location and live there. Peter Biello: Yeah well what do you think Pat is. We're gonna cue you up and bring into the program listeners in just a moment but I want to ask about the role that Mountain Lions play in the ecosystem we've been talking a lot about mountain lions traveling and being sort of hard to track as they move. Pat do they typically just move around a lot. So. So you know until I found those two scats I didn't think that mountain lions were here in the east. They create these big latrines that are very obvious. I just want to tell you a story that I read. What's going on. The big cat has been extinct here since the mid-1800s. Patrick Tate: If I could just say one thing. And I saw you cat about four feet long from nose to tail come across from the water across the road and just leap over a six foot perimeter fence in a single bound. Caller: Are probably. Mark Elbroch doesnt think so. Are there Mountain Lions in NH? Somewhere the way they travel the things they do they're going to leave evidence. Do you want to see real, living mountain lions that do exist in New Hampshire. Patrick Tate: Same here in New Hampshire too. So it's there was no question in my mind. We'll hear from her periodically through the show. I just stood there just a second and I came to a complete stop and then I ran away. Tonight, Sean McDonald investigates,. The Eastern mountain lion is extinct in the eastern United States and Canada, but in 2011, a . Peter Biello: Worth mentioning if we're scaring anybody question a mysterious mountain lions lurking perhaps in someone's backyard. And what was really remarkable about the whole thing was I was maybe a half mile down on all buildings. The number 1 800 8 9 2 6 4 7 7 so promised a discussion about conspiracy theories. Had great trees behind it beautiful ferns on the ground so it brought me down on the site and the ferns on the ground matched. Seems reasonable! There was a lot of DNA evidence. The second story window through about 30 feet away from it. Peter Biello: Thank you for sharing that. I didn't see him online. Sam Evans-Brown has been working for New Hampshire Public Radio since 2010, when he began as a freelancer. There's always been physical evidence to prove those situations like hair or fur scat hair prints pictures of the animal print scat hair. We discuss what residents may have been seeing and what breeding mountain lion pairs would mean for our ecosystem. The nonbelievers are going to say Show us your evidence and show us prove this to us. So give us a call now. Join as a $8 per month sustainer and get our brand-new owl umbrella! Do they travel. Known to exist in the state for over well over a hundred years. Okay. Part II. Long before NASA was asked to put a man on the moon one engineer had already figured out how to get there. We've met Fish and Game's BURDEN OF PROOF. Many people in New Hampshire have claimed to have seen mountain lions. Do cougars live in New England? Thanks also to Rick van de Poll naturalist and founder of ecosystem management consultants of New England and Sam Evans Brown host of an HP podcast outside in about the natural world and how we use it. So do they. Patrick Tate: Well. But if you do if you think you're looking at a wild Puma their tail is very thick and especially in the winter is very thick and ponderous looking. Here it is. So take care of this problem. Mike you're on the air. Caller: I cannot recall or see the tail in my in my image of it. There's never, ever, ever, ever been a documented case of a black mountain lion. Peter Biello: We got an e-mail question from Robert in Epsom who asks are sightings or encounters with these big cats less dangerous here where they're passing through than out west where those same mountain lines might be establishing territory Rick. And now that everyone and their mother has a remote camera in their back yard its just so, so unlikely that there are resident, breeding mountain lions in New England that are living invisibly among us, he says, Its become Big Foot.. In my New Hampshire career I have written several, and seen at least 20, stories along the lines of "local person thinks they saw a mountain lion but there's no actual evidence aside from. We'd love to have you in the queue. If you missed part of today's program listen to the exchange. The trouble with accepting every reported sighting as a confirmed mountain lion is that there are so many mistaken identifications. Course like Sue said you have to see it and it's not always that visible. Thanks for taking my call. So the U.S. Forest Service Rocky Mountain Research Station has a database on mountain lion and they can identify. To date most of the pictures that have been sent in have been bobcats and other species Ive received pictures of house cats. Your support makes this news available to everyone. For instance, Floridas wildlife officials have a similar ghost cat: the black panther. Mountain lions when they show up they leave evidence. And still the the folks there did weren't able to come up with it with 100 percent certainty what deposited that scat. So so they're just a very resilient species and they're pretty they're pretty neat. We send out DNA samples to the U.S. Forest Service Rocky Mountain Research Station. And so so with their limited staff and limited budget that is that is more and more limited every year because you know fewer people are buying hunting and fishing licenses. If youd like to submit a question (or send a mountain line photo) you can record it as a voice memo on your smart phone and send it tooustidein@nhpr.org, OR call our hotline, 1-844-GO-OTTER (1-844-466-8837) and leave a message. They're the generalists that made it through both the arrival of the Clovis people with their with their spears and then the Europeans with their guns. So I hate the idea that there's some sort of upward you know downward pressure from the bosses saying Don't you know don't tell about the mountain lions because it'll scare away the tourists. Thank you. Patrick Tate: Nice talk to you too. Some are included in lists of mountains, such as the Appalachian Mountain Club (AMC) list of the Hundred Highest peaks of New England, or the . But if you were to get Western dispersing mountain lions just would just sort of expanding into New Hampshire. Peter Biello: Today on the program Patrick Tate New Hampshire Fish and Game Wildlife biologist and far better project leader Sam Evans Brown host of an HP podcast outside in which is about the natural world and how we use it. If you believe you have seen a mountain lion and want to report it to NH Fish and Game, please contact the Wildlife Division at (603) 271-2461 or wildlife@wildlife.nh.gov to request an observation report form. These were normal everyday folks. Want to report a Mountain Lion sighting in New Hampshire? Fear for others and those two polarizing opinions on the situation is what I believe brings out mystique and Sam you know I take kind of a long view on this. Patrick Tate: Martin Like what about Panther Panther saying animals same animal and like a bit of trivia Guinness Book of World Records says the animal with the most names is in English alone they're supposedly 40 names for Mount lion. He told me that on one of his many scouting trips for Black Bear he found a deer carcass up in a tree. And there's there's no evidence of that cat's movement in that entire you know 12 hundred miles stretch of its journey. So I think the point that I just want to get across is that there is a very strong sense this here in the and not region that there is that there is some sort of mountain lion population how large it is how extensive it is. So and so they so they do get pretty involved. Sam Evans-Brown: Pretty well I was going to say it is nice to hear about how to identify the facial markings but probably I'd being a to identify the tracks is probably the more useful useful tool that one can have in their tool box. Pelosi story here we go. Peter Biello: This is the exchange on an HD PR fine Peter Biello and today we're talking with folks who can tell us about the mysterious elusive mountain line and whether or not it is actually here in New Hampshire. This is the exchange. m from a weed family Automotive on store Street in Concord is serving the Concord area families automotive needs since 1995. And it was you know 10 or 12 people saw it all at once. Sam Evans-Brown: Certainly that is a thing I've heard but again you have to think of the incentives involved here. New Hampshire Fish and Game Department says there's no proof. So they're not afraid of humans and they'll show up like a regular housecat. I'm Peter Biello. So there is definitely no downward pressure by anyone. Verifiable pictures recorded by the observing person or a trail camera. So I know it's another unconfirmed report but you string enough of these together. So they're scary. And I just said I saw I saw they from behind the shoulder all the way past the long tail. Residents believe cougars still roam New Hampshire's forests. Let's talk to Mike in Webster. Just one quick point I think I think when we we talk about these conspiracy theories the real story is that fish and game is an agency that that is short on budget and staff. You need a permit to have that. Its closest living relative is the cheetah. OK. That location they just described we had two or three Bobcats radio collared on just off the runway in Laconia airport. 8 9 2 6 4 7 7. So let's let's go to the phones. The report came in from a conservation officer. Sam Evans-Brown: So I just had two thoughts which is that we hear a lot of these stories and all of us here have heard these stories. Mountain Lions in New Hampshire-Fact or Fiction 3,207 views Jul 31, 2019 78 Dislike Share Save New Hampshire Fish and Wildlife 634 subscribers During my thirty-one career at the New.

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