Balrogs are intelligent sentient beings. To a lesser degree Faramir's disobedience also saved the Quest. By clicking Accept all cookies, you agree Stack Exchange can store cookies on your device and disclose information in accordance with our Cookie Policy. Although he never appears directly in the books and is only shown in the movies in a flashback to the War of the Last Alliance, his corruptive influence is felt nearly everywhere in Middle-Earth. Will to conquer all life in Middle-earth was the last bit I believe. Sauron is the primary villain of The Lord Of The Rings. The Lord of the Rings; Middle-Earth (Franchise) entertainment news All credit must go to the talented artists. For example, Beregond is reprimanded for leaving his post but is assigned to a position of honor by Aragorn in recognition of why he disobeyed. Saruman in the Shire: how long had he been planning it? https://www.patreon.com/thebrokensword-----Also if you want to support in a different way then check out our Teespring page where we upload original designs for our merch! No one could even comprehend the length of His existence. Would Sauron be able to open two fronts, battling against Isengard and Gondor? Amy Ratcliffe is the Editor-in-Chief for Nerdist and the author ofStar Wars: Women of the Galaxy, The Art of Star Wars: Galaxys Edge, The Jedi Mind, and more. I got down on bended knee at the top of the mountain and proposed. The images have been re-edited so I hope you enjoy! No doubt he would have exercised all his powers searching the area from Parth Galen where the Ringbearer departed to the Black Gate. What Would Happen if Saruman Got the One Ring in LOTR? But the Ring and all its works would have endured. This moment was part of an overall mistake, and they could be wrong about this observation, too. The thing is, it's worth wondering what would have happened if Frodo had failed. The villain created The One Ring, where he put most of his power. The stone had a green/purple coloring. By the time we meet Saruman in The Lord of the Rings, hes up to no good. In conclusion, if a Maia (Gandalf or Saruman) would get and use the ring, a bitter fight to the end would ensue between the keeper of the ring and Sauron, a fight even more bitter than the one between elves and orcs, Gondor and Mordor, much like an evil kinstrife to the death. Gandalf was going to announce that Sauron had found the Ring. After all, they would both want the other one's full and utter . When the White Council was formed around T.A. The Palantri. It would have been the master in the end. He sees the Dark Lord as a rival and also an aspiration. Why does Gollum calling the ring his own not alert Sauron? This perfectly explained how the Ring could have gotten from Sauron to Isildur to Gollum to . On February 26, 3019 Eomer, Third Marshal of the Riddermark, set out against orders from his king to hunt an orc band coming from the east. Saruman would have made a tasty little morsel for Sauron. Sauron then spends the rest of his life torturing Saruman for daring to try and take the ring for himself. Anybody else who bore it (non-stop) would eventually be drawn to him, where he would get the Ring back. In fact, he had started searching for the . Saruman is ruined when the Riders of Rohan defeat his army and Merry and Pippin prompt the Ents to destroy Isengard. Saruman is my favorite figure of all time . He easily would have had mastery over the ring itself. We dont know if the Stranger will make it to his destination and the show could certainly deviate from lore or invent new history ( as it has done already). It has been suggested that the reason why Saruman lost access to magic after the . They are not beasts. Ap. Not true. That success would be the usual bitter victory, though, because first the new wielder of the ring would need to build his own power, and learn the mastery of the ring. It may not display this or other websites correctly. The Rise Of LOTR's Witch-king Of Angmar. The Silmarillion says Saruman was the eldest Istari and came first. See Palantr Wikipedia . He would simply wait and let the Ring do what it was made to do. " The Hunt for the Ring " is a chapter in Unfinished Tales, a posthumously published work of J.R.R. Does he use his great voice, enhanced by the One to subjugate the free peoples. Blake Hawkins has written TV and movie features and recaps for CBR since March of 2021. How could Sauron defeat Saruman, or even pay him a visit if he's disembodied? Earlier in the same letter we see just exactly how useful the Ring would have been to a hypothetical Ring-bearing Saruman (or anyone else, for that matter): Sauron would not have feared the Ring! Short story taking place on a toroidal planet or moon involving flying, Acidity of alcohols and basicity of amines, The difference between the phonemes /p/ and /b/ in Japanese, Replacing broken pins/legs on a DIP IC package. We'll pick u. Sauron was stronger than Gandalf in the Lord of the Rings, but it has to be said that there were a few different shapes of both characters. We don't know enough about the powers of the Ring, in the hands of an ambitious wizard how it might have worked as a "devastating weapon" (Letter 246), how, as a symbol, it might in Saruman's hands have affected Sauron's servants and vassals. Tolkien says in Letter 246 that the Ring is not only comparable to "a devastating weapon" (which Frodo doesn't know how to use) but also to "an object of terror in their religious cult, by which they had been conditioned to treat one who wielded it with servility". Courage to ones fellows, hope in adversity, and comfort to the suffering were the powers enhanced by the three. That was a major concern for Sauron, and one of the reasons he felt constrained to hurry his stroke to gain mastery of the world without the ring. The chapter is a partly published version of a manuscript now held at the Marquette University (MSS 4/2/31-37); [1] other parts of this manuscript and a time scheme have been included in The . Thus, the power of the Ring is both direct (like the power of a weapon) and symbolic (like the power of a cult object). The implication is that Saruman has to defeat Sauron. What did Tolkien originally write? First its a lucky hit, now its a super-human with a magical super-sword? Well what DID the Ring do for Sauron? Eomer had no clue about rings and quests. Anybody else who bore it (non-stop) would eventually be drawn to him, where he would get the Ring back. If he didn't get the Truth from Saruman, he could get it from the halflings and if they were dead due to Saruman, capture and question any of Saruman's orcs or men roaming between Isengard and the Black Gate. 1. The Mystics, believing the Stranger is Sauron, tell him he must go to Rhn to fully explore his powers. Ummm, thats what the One Ring does for someone who has zero magical ability. Sauron was the Dark Lord in The Lord of the Rings saga, written by J.R.R. As Sauron once was, Saruman, a Maia of Aule, became absorbed in Ring-lore as he studied Sauron's evil works. In this scenario, Sauron likely would have recovered his Ring and covered all the lands in a second darkness. Cookie Notice If Saruman had not been corrupted in the first place, the war might have gone much easier for the Free Peoples. 3 yr. ago. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. If he succeeded in doing that, Sauron would have been defeated because it was his saving anchor. But he didn't because Eomer disobeyed his king and destroyed an orc band that had the most crucial thing needed by both Saruman and Sauron - information. Through them Tolkien shows Faramir and Eomer's quality was in not being blind followers of loyalty and obedience to king and father but seeing a bigger picture and being obedient to a greater purpose. #2. This mod, although it doesn't add a new staff to the game, creates a unique design for all of the Skyrim staves. If any artists would like us to remove their artwork, or add anything additional to credit you, please contact us and we will sort it straight away! Narsil was made by the dwarves not elves. By the end of Return of the King, Saruman has lost his powers and has resorted to becoming a lowly criminal. Saruman was known for being subtle in speech (with a powerful ability to sway others with his voice) and skilled in smithcraft. So it is my assumption that Saruman wanted the One Ring so he could forge his own Ring of Power. Even if Saruman won this hypothetical battle, it would be ultimately irrelevant. By this Tolkien shows that disobedience for good reasons has merit. RELATED: The Lord of the Rings: 10 Details About Sauron's Costume You Never Noticed This incident, one of those that was invented for the film to increase tension, is an incredible missed opportunity for the minions of the Dark . But there isn't a blind following of obedience in Tolkien at least not with wise and just characters depending on the circumstances. Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for LEGO The Lord of the Rings Tower of Orthanc (10237) at the best online prices at eBay! What If SARUMAN managed to get his hands on the One Ring and how that effects all events afterwards! If he followed the strategy I've mentioned, his fighters would have to deal with the feisty Rohirrim, and would also run the risk of a flank attack from Gondor, before they could even get near Isengard. Unfortunately, Sauron had got on the wrong side of a particularly powerful race: the Nmenreans.The isle of Nmenr was a realm of men that sat apart from Middle-earth and those who lived there were more powerful than the men seen elsewhere in The Lord of . How did Saruman become corrupted? Some interesting conjecture, but you're forgetting that if anyone replaced Sauron as the "master" of the One Ruling Ring, they would sever Sauron's tie to the ring and essentially reduce him to an ineffectual spirit who could no longer interact with the physical world. Necessary cookies are absolutely essential for the website to function properly. When the good wizard Saruman uses one to spy on the peoples of Middle-earth, he is drawn in by its power and ensnared by . All the latest gaming news, game reviews and trailers. Did Peter Jackson take inspiration for Gollum from "Dracula 1931" movie. It wasn't really a surprise. Even from afar he had an effect upon it, to make it work for its return to himself. Nazgul were formidable opponants, under the right circumstances. The first and most obvious reason Galadriel gets to hang on to her Ring - Nenya, the Ring of Water - from beginning (i.e. The Lord Of The Rings. But he didn't because Eomer disobeyed his king and destroyed an orc band that had the most crucial thing needed by both Saruman and Sauron - information. We look at sections of The Lord of the Rings and Tolkien's letters to answer the question - what would happen if Sauron reclaimed The One Ring? I don't think it would have made Saruman invincible, and, after all, he still would still have had to contend for instance with Treebeard and the Ents, as well as with Sauron. Hes of the same order of beings as Sauron, so he certainly has enough power to effectively use the ring. The One Ring has a number of powers and depending on what information (particularly regarding the Middle Earth RPG) you will get very vague to very specific capabilties for the One Ring. Thanks for contributing an answer to Science Fiction & Fantasy Stack Exchange! There's this passage that describes what happened after the death of his physical body: To the dismay of those that stood by, about the body of Saruman a grey mist gathered, and rising slowly to a great height like smoke from a fire, as a pale shrouded figure it loomed over the Hill. You have different tier options between $2 - $250, which can get you everything from exclusive access to upcoming videos, shoutouts, discounts, access to original artwork, producer credits on productions etc. He fought Uruk-hai (who had captured Merry and Pippin thinking they were Frodo) and were enroute to Isengard. I recall the Narsil having been forged by the elves, using elvish magic. Chief among the powers of the ring that were feared by the White Council was the fact that if Sauron put it on now, all that had been done by the Wise using the three rings would be revealed to him, as would their minds, if they did not take off the rings. Tolkein himself said that it would have been a difficult battle, and might have gone either way, but that One of the true great powers could have dedfeated Sauron by using the Ring. Sorry, memory fails me ATM. Does it shoot bolts of kickarse out of it's hilt? I say this because Saruman would never have destroyed the ring and so the ring would have eventually consumed him since Sauron was its true master. Its probably been done already, and if so I apologize, but: If Saruman had gotten his greedy lil mitts on the one ring, would he have been able to set himself up as a new dark lord (or however they call themselves)? Saruman summon the storm on Caradhras in the PJverse in The Fellowship of the Ring. In The Lord of the Rings, the palantri corrupt nearly all who use them. He's the anti-hero in his own story who spends time with the Blue Wizards in the East, heads up the White Council, and eventually . I don't think we have enough information to answer this with certainty. Covering the hottest movie and TV topics that fans want. Sauron would then have suspended his campaign against Minas Tirith, and instead sent his armies north-west, through Rohan towards Isengard. It basically lets them look unique according to their enchantment. *Originally posted by Triskadecamus * What about Galadrial? What video game is Charlie playing in Poker Face S01E07? If Saruman destroyed Sauron If he won, he would become a great L. (Of the Rings of Power and the Third Age, The Silmarillion as far as the quoted material here goes). Well Gandalf and Galadriel were pretty confident in their ability to defeat Sauron using One Ring! Saruman has his own glorious rise to power before falling to ruin. A place where magic is studied and practiced? They'd be capable of wielding it and would be a threat to Sauron, though Sauron would probably win in the end as The Ring was only . It may not display this or other websites correctly. Two Maiar duking it out at their full strength would have brought ruin to much of Middle-earth, and that was exactly what the Valar had hoped to avoid in the first place. Why are Suriname, Belize, and Guinea-Bissau classified as "Small Island Developing States"? Imagine that, after breaking of Fellowship, Saruman`s Uruk-Hai capture Frodo and bring him, with the ring, to Isengard. That means Frodo had to destroy the Ring to destroy Sauron for good. Gandalf had the last one, though Im not sure anyone but Cirdan, Himself, and Elrond and Galadriel knew it. Saruman was most skilled in Ring Lore, save Sauron. So it's possible that someone of sufficient power could break the Rings bond to Sauron. Saruman had decided to abandon his mission as an Istari and join Sauron in subjugating Middle-earth. Saruman didn't know what Gandalf wanted to say, but he could guess. His actions were more indirect as his decision was of non-action in not taking Frodo to Minas Tirith. Whats the threshold of power for a wielder of the one ring to defeat Sauron? Gil Galad, and the last alliance also defeated Sauron, without the help of the Maiar, as well. It does not store any personal data. Sauron would also realize the captured Halflings did not have the Ring so all the doubt surrounding Aragorn having it would be absent. Both the direct and symbolic aspects could have helped Saruman expand his empire by winning adherents and frightening potential opponents. I would have thought that they would have been used against Sauron if at all possible while he didnt have the one. Obviously, the Uruk-hai didn't make it back to Isengard, and they didn't have the Ring anyway. Telchar, an uber Dwarven smith who lived in the first age, forged Narsil. Posted September 4, 2007. mysticalblues said: My roommate met someone last week that had a ring that she got in St. Thomas. Opens in new tab Opens in new tab Opens in new tab. On the other hand, if the Stranger is Saruman, consider that journey and how it makes his transformation all the more tragic. Sauron w. He also had control of the nine kings and such or was supposed to, although didn't Elrond get a ring yet was present at the battle? He also used his Palantir to spy on Sauron. Too well studied, as it turned out, for Saruman gradually turned to evil himself, emulating Sauron's works. Of course, Saruman was shocked to hear about the One Ring but wasn't going to help Gandalf conceal it because he had already chosen a new course of action. RELATED: How Morgoth Created Glaurung and The Lord of the Rings' Dragons. This is what Sauron feared that his enemies would do, if they got the Ring; and that's the only reason he feared them. Maybe, though i dont know that much about Sauman's power and. rev2023.3.3.43278. Is Taco Bell healthier than other fast food? Their power was in preserving and healing the hurts done to the earth, and to those who were harmed by evil. If Im not mistaken, he is Vanyar? ncdu: What's going on with this second size column? His Spirit would continue in some astral realm, and would use His real weapon: TIME. The thing is, that wouldn't be a simple task. "In a hole in the ground there lived a rabbit? Why are trials on "Law & Order" in the New York Supreme Court? The Vanyar were one of the tribes/families of the elves. I mean, he was supposed to be powerful ANYWAY was he not? He also had control of the nine kings and such or was supposed to, although didn't Elrond get a ring yet was present at the battle? Director Peter Jackson adapted the books into six films divided into two trilogies The Lord of the Rings and The Hobbit.More popularly referred to as The Lord of the Rings movies, watching them in chronological order helps viewers place certain disparate events . At the same time, most of the Elves were leaving Middle-earth, and Saruman betrayed everyone and joined Sauron. That Saruman is nothing like the Stranger who falls from the sky in The Rings of Power. Also, it says in the book that the Nazgul went to Isengard demanding news of the ring and if Sauraman had the ring, Sauraman said if I had the ring you would bow down to me and call me lord I think Saruman would've won if he captured the ring. So, it seems Sauron is not invincible, even with the ring, much less against it. Got caught and lost a mind-to-mind battle. mostly minifigs and decorated bricks. Gandalf, however, likely took Saruman's position, not knowing that Saruman had invented the story of it washing out to sea and was looking for the One Ring for himself. **, And this kind of begs the question - What had been done with the three? Today we jump back in time to one of our older videos at one of our What If scenarios! )https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCScfG2CfbSh_LUzkGJ_p-aAHistory of Dragon Ball - (For all things Dragon Ball! You are using an out of date browser. Gandalf was hand-selected and sent by Manw. Gandalf wasn't even sure if he would be able to break his staff in The Return of the King, and that was a very weakened version of Saruman. You also have the option to opt-out of these cookies. :)#LordoftheRingsWhatIf #Saruman #WhatIfSaruman But eventually the Ring would subvert their efforts and bring about evil. Such uses can be done without permission from the copyright owner.In the event I use art of yours or you have any questions, please contact me and we'll get it sorted straight away! In the case of vague powers the One Ring would enhance one's powers based on one's strengths. His own greed and lust for power turned him to darkness on his own, and Sauron through the Palantir had already turned Saruman into his tool - though Saruman was of no use to Sauron at all once defeated. It may not display this or other websites correctly. But what was the purpose of the three? What happens next? When Gandalf returned and revealed himself to Aragorn, Gimli and Legolas in Fangorn he said something to the effect of "in a way I'm now Saruman, but you can keep calling me Gandalf." Indeed, Saruman needed no ring to become enslaved. The cookie is used to store the user consent for the cookies in the category "Other. We know that disobedience can bring ruin such as what happened with the Noldor when they disobeyed the Valar or the Army of the Dead when they disobeyed Isildur and broke their oath to fight for him. Saruman comes to look down on hobbits. Either way, the good guys loose big. Keep Your Powder Dry: Firearms for 5E Fantasy CampaignsNearly 40 firearms with customization options for 5E games, plus magic items, feats for gunslingers, and the alchemist character class! Rohan would've fallen to Saruman and wouldn't have been able to come to the aid of Gondor and helped make the final stand against the forces of Mordor at the Black Gate. Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience. Why are physically impossible and logically impossible concepts considered separate in terms of probability? Five wizards came to Middle-earth, so the Stranger could be any of them. So if Saruman mastered the Ring, he would become the next Dark Lord of Middle-earth. In what way? He sees the Dark Lord as a rival and also an aspiration. It was his own and under his will. The Lord of the Rings (LOTR) by J. R. R. Tolkien is one of the greatest and most famous epic fantasy series in English literature. And if the hearts of men were not so easily tainted, the Ringwraiths might never have been brought into being. Probably, upon creation, Saruman was weaker than Gandalf and Sauron, and he spent his entire existence trying to increase his power, leading to his jealousy of Gandalf and eventual betrayal. As was made quite clear at the Council of Elrond, as long as the Ring existed Sauron could not fully be destroyed. What money is available for senior citizens? What would happen if Gandalf had the ring? Which routine is best for gaining muscle? Would Saruman have been able to defeat Sauron? In his mind, it was the only logical thing to do, and he offered Gandalf a place by his side. He did not fear Sauron, but rather was forbidden to contest with him directly. Plus, if the Stranger is Saruman, it also makes Gandalfs journey and decisions all the more important and emphasizes an ongoing theme in Tolkiens works: every being has the power to choose between good and evil, or selflessness vs. selfishness. The cookie is set by GDPR cookie consent to record the user consent for the cookies in the category "Functional". Hes lost his way in a search for greater power. It's much more likely that Saruman would have used the One Ring for himself and tried to claim Middle-earth as his own. Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/TheBrokenSwordYouTube/Twitter https://twitter.com/TheBroken_SwordInstagram https://www.instagram.com/thebroken_sword/----------Please consider subscribing to the channel for all future updates based on the Lord of the Rings!Any future news and updates regarding the show or anything else, we will be sure to let you guys know ASAP!Also, if you have any suggestions for future videos too, then please leave a comment below!----------We do not claim to own the rights to any of the art work used throughout this video. Saruman was Maia like Sauron. With the more powerful becoming all the more corrupted. Some interesting conjecture, but you're forgetting that if anyone replaced Sauron as the "master" of the One Ruling Ring, they would sever Sauron's tie to the ring and essentially reduce him to an ineffectual spirit who could no longer interact with the physical world. The question of what Saruman would have done therefore becomes moot since it seems inevitable that Sauron would have been the stronger. Frodo was a hobbit with one companion, in the heart of Sauron's realm. the scene in which Gandalf, say, was placed in such a position. However, Gandalf knew that if he being an extremely powerful Maiar just like Sauron had taken the One Ring, he would become no different than the Dark Lord. Frodo would have continued into Mordor and odds are he would have been discovered there. Privacy Policy. He and his servants already knew of his involvement in the attack on the Fellowship and the capture of the hobbits. Still it was a meritorious disobedience and worthy of praise. Seem's strange when the ring's main purpose was to rule over the rings/leaders? His three friends were smiling at him, but Gandalf was only managing an embarrassed smile towards the Lady. Who is more popular Leonardo DiCaprio or Tom Cruise? Are there tables of wastage rates for different fruit and veg? Any idea what set any of these are from? Either way, the battle between them would have been a catastrophic lose-lose situation for everyone. But if Eomer hadn't disobeyed orders? I'm a little vague on this point. He is, I suppose, the same order of creature as Sauron himself, so could he? This cookie is set by GDPR Cookie Consent plugin. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. Reddit and its partners use cookies and similar technologies to provide you with a better experience. She seems to have seriously pondered what she might do if she got hold of the Ring, and she was only an Elf, not a Maiar like Saruman. In Rivendell, Frodo all but offers the Ring to Aragorn, saying Then it belongs to you, and not to me at all! (FOTR260). He will likely go through some things, but that would mean the Gandalf we meet in the Second Age is largely the same as the Gandalf in the Third Age. By the time of The Lord of the Rings, Saruman has become jealous of Sauron's power (and Gandalf's too). . Did she think she could have avoided being drawn to Sauron if she did seize the Ring? Saruman tries to master the ring, but he doesn't completely achieve such mastery. Powered by Discourse, best viewed with JavaScript enabled. Be specific and add in your sources, we prefer not to have speculation here. I'm no Tolkien expert but I assume there would have been a great war between Isengard and Mordor, which would have affected all parts of Middle Earth. But maybe thats a reason why hes Saruman and not Gandalf. So if Saruman mastered the Ring, he would become the . These cookies track visitors across websites and collect information to provide customized ads. He easily would have had mastery over the ring itself. Is the man a thousand times stronger than a normal man? When Sauron was in Dol Guldur, he lay dormant most of the time. A limit involving the quotient of two sums. After a comment from Gimli, Gandalf adds: "But Isengard cannot fight Mordor, unless Saruman first obtains the Ring. Galadriel and Gandalf each made a conscious decision not to embark on such a course; but Saruman would not have hesitated. And so that's what Gandalf was pretending to do, while they were actually taking the Ring to Mt.

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